My new project

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Re: My new project

Post by frank1956 on Wed Nov 05, 2014 12:20 pm

I meant probably not the cure!! Very Happy
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Re: My new project

Post by frank1956 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 4:12 pm

Got the new volume control in yesterday, just got through installing it Mad Same problem slight hum, volume control does not make it go up or down. Re-checked all tube's and they are good. Wiring looks correct, not sure wish way to go from here. I was at least hoping the volume control would be 99.9% of the problem, no cigar confused
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Re: My new project

Post by frank1956 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 5:13 pm

Since I replaced the volume control, I was going to re-take my voltage reading. I may have told a little white lie. I notice on the 35W4 tube the wiring does not look/match up to the schematic. Per the schematic there should be no connection on pin's #1,2 6. This tube lay out has me a little confused now that I look at it. If I am reading the 35W4 tube correctly pin #1 has no connection, pin's #2 & 3 are connected together. Pin #4 has no connection, pin's #5 have a connection and pin's 6 & 7 are connected together. I have attached a picture to try and confirm or deny this.

Frank




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Re: My new project

Post by frank1956 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 5:39 pm

Correction pin's # 6 & 7 are not connected together, rather pin #6 is connected to the 50B5 tube.
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Re: My new project

Post by 75X11 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 5:40 pm

According to the schematic, pins 4 and 5 are supposed to be connected together and to the unswitched lead of your AC input. Be sure to check your layout by the pin outs on page 17-18.
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Re: My new project

Post by 75X11 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 5:43 pm

Pin 3 is supposed to go to pin 4 of the 50B5 tube. Maker sure you have your pin numbers correct.
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Re: My new project

Post by frank1956 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 7:20 pm

75X11 wrote:According to the schematic, pins 4 and 5 are supposed to be connected together and to the unswitched lead of your AC input.  Be sure to check your layout by the pin outs on page 17-18.


There are no numbers on the tube sockets, that is what is confusing to me. What is a pin outs, page 17-18 not sure what that is.


Frank
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Re: My new project

Post by frank1956 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 7:34 pm

Another look at the 35W4 tube socket.





Frank
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Re: My new project

Post by 75X11 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 7:34 pm

http://www.nostalgiaair.org/PagesByModel/494/M0003494.pdf

Each of these pages are numbered. The second page has the socket voltage chart with a physical layout of the underside of the tube sockets, with the pins corresponding letters, numbers and the voltage that should be read at each pin. It is a good place to get your bearings when comparing the schematic to the actual layout.
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Re: My new project

Post by frank1956 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 7:40 pm

That is what I looked at while I was doing my voltage reading and discovered the possible problem. As I said there are no numbers on the socket. The socket is not laid out the same as the socket voltage chart and is hard for me to get my bearings. No matter which way I look at it now the pin's that are not suppose to have connections do???


Frank
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Re: My new project

Post by 75X11 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 7:45 pm

I can't make out in your picture where the socket position with no lug.  There should be one position without a lug. From that position count clockwise.
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Re: My new project

Post by frank1956 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 9:00 pm

I believe where I have indicated in the attached picture is the no lug position, but can't be 100% sure. That pin# 2 has a connection. Per the schematic there should only be 4 connection on the 35W4 tube/pin's. I have 5 connections.




Frank
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Re: My new project

Post by 75X11 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 9:31 pm

Pin 2 is being used as a tie point. it has no connection within the tube. pin 3 should have 1 wire on it, going to pin 4 of your 50B5 tube as part of your filament or "heater" string.
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Re: My new project

Post by frank1956 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 9:53 pm

I am going to completely take all wires off and start from scratch.

Pin # 2 at this point is tie into pin # 5 of the 50B5, also the negative side of the electrolytic and the 1200 ohm resistor.

Per the schematic pin # 7 35W4 is suppose to be tied into both the pos & neg electrolytic, 1200 ohm resistor a .02 capacitor and pin # 5 50B5. It look like pin's 3 & 4 are supposed to be tied together. And pin # 5 is tie into the unswitched lead of the AC  via a .05 capacitor.
Does this sound about right??

Thanks
Frank
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Re: My new project

Post by 75X11 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 10:11 pm

From what I see in the schematic your first tie point from the 35w4 pin 7 is only 1 of your 2 electrolytics that replaced the multi section. That also ties to the 1200 ohm resistor, then to another tie point with the .02 cap and one leg of your speaker output transformer. The .02 cap goes across and is tied to the other leg of your speaker output transformer. Also tied to that point is your lead to pin 5 of the 50b5. That is what i see according to the schematic.
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Re: My new project

Post by Wildcat445 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 10:12 pm

Oops, I was posting as 75 was.  75 has you going the right direction.   Very Happy

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Re: My new project

Post by frank1956 on Sun Nov 09, 2014 10:22 pm

75X11 wrote:From what I see in the schematic your first tie point from the 35w4 pin 7 is only 1 of your 2 electrolytics that replaced the multi section.  That also ties to the 1200 ohm resistor, then to another tie point with the .02 cap and one leg of your speaker output transformer.  The .02 cap goes across and is tied to the other leg of your speaker output transformer.  Also tied to that point is your lead to pin 5 of the 50b5.  That is what i see according to the schematic.

I agree with that. Where I marked in the last pic of the no lug position, that is correct, as I went back and verified it with the actual tube. Which means that pin # 2 of the 35W4 tube has a connection, when according to the schematics it should not. That being said does that not mean the whole tube is wired wrong?? It that is the case then it needs to be re-wired and I will need some assist on that as my schematics reading/interpretation is not correct.


Frank
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Re: My new project

Post by frank1956 on Mon Nov 10, 2014 12:44 am

Alright I am official an idiot. I went back after much of I am not sure of anything and re-looked at the wiring of the 35W4 tube. After cleaning years of crap off of it I realized I was wrong and the tube is wired correctly. Now with that out of the way, on to more pressing issues as to why this radio, after a new volume control has a slight hum, which the volume control does not have an effect on!!!

Again all tube have been tested and come up good-all wiring is correct and intacted. Took new voltage reading after installing the volume control and figuring out the 35W4 tube was corrected. The new reading are below. What would be my next step in troubleshooting this Crosley, other then actually shooting it  lol!  No seriously I would like to get it running!!!

12BA6 Pins # 3 36, # 4 24, #5 27 and # 6 85
50B5 Pins # 2 -5.1, # 3 36, #4 92, #5 126 and #6 83
35W4 Pins #3 92, #4 125, # 5 125 and #7 138
50B5 Pins # 2 -5.1, # 3 36, # 4 92, # 5 126 and # 6 83
12BE6 Pins # 1 25, # 3 23, # 4 11, # 5 86 and # 6 85

Frank
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Re: My new project

Post by frank1956 on Mon Nov 10, 2014 11:57 am

Dr. Radio wrote:Hey Frank, sorry for the delay. Been a crazy week.

Your pin 5 and pin 2 from the 12AT6 definitely need to tie to the common B-.

Here's what I have suggested to others in the past to quickly determine if your audio circuits work.

Grab a battery powered portable radio, walkman, cd player, mp3 player whatever, as long as it has a earphone jack. "Sacrifice" an old set of earphones/headphones by leaving the little plug alone, but cut off the part that went on your ear(s).  If it is a stereo set-up, leave one channel (left or right) just left un-connected, but leave the wires apart so they don't short together. You just need one set of "output" wires. When you strip the cable you'll have a shield (raw wire) and a colored insulated wire. This is....drum roll...you're new audio injector!

Take the audio "ground" or shield/raw wire and connect to B- of your radio.  Take the signal wire (insulated wire) and install a .1 uF @ 600 volt capacitor in series with it (this protects your portable from stray voltage). The other end of the cap is now your probe. (If this is just a mono earphone, there are no shield/center conductors, just separate the wires and connect either one as described.) Connect this probe point (the other end of the cap)to the input side of your radio's audio circuitry. In your case, you'd connect it to where the 47k resistor, the .00025 cap and the 3.3M resistor all tie together. Does the radio play your own music wonderfully?  IF it does, the AF (audio frequency) circuitry is fine. If no, you've got some tracing and checking to do.




Dr. Radio,
I obtained the items I needed to preform the above test, but unfortunately with negative results Crying or Very sad
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Re: My new project

Post by frank1956 on Mon Nov 10, 2014 3:09 pm

Dr. Radio,
This is what my setup looks like. Do I need all the bare wire to conduct the test? The reason I ask is I went back and re-read your post and to look at your diagram, and I used all the bare wires (raw wires) to connected to the B- vice one as used in your diagram. This is just one ear piece removed and striped.

Frank

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Re: My new project

Post by frank1956 on Thu Nov 13, 2014 12:09 pm

Can someone give me an idea of what I need to do next. Dr. Radio stated if the above test did not work then I would have some tracing and checking to do???

Tracing and checking of what???


Thanks
Frank
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Re: My new project

Post by 75X11 on Thu Nov 13, 2014 12:48 pm

Be patient and let Dr. radio get you set up with the probe. He is very good at this aspect of this. and it will be worth waiting for.
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Re: My new project

Post by frank1956 on Fri Nov 14, 2014 8:16 am

Will do.
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Re: My new project

Post by Dr. Radio on Sat Nov 15, 2014 10:57 pm

Hi Frank!

Didn't forget Smile

As far as your audio test rig goes, each channel (left and right) share a common (same color), then the left channel and the right channel have their own colors. It's okay to connect both commons together, or just a single common as it all goes back to the same point. You need to decide if you want to use the left or right output wire. Doesn't matter which. What DOES matter is the other channel (that you aren't using is simply left disconnected, not shorted to anything, just floating. The other important thing is you must use the .1 @600 volt cap in series like I showed in the picture. This will prevent your audio source from going up in smoke if you slip up and connect to raw DC.

The wire you have there can be a pain to solder with its tiny size and it's enameled coating. Solder carefully and thoroughly to make a good connection.

The first step will be making sure your rig works. You can use the speaker in the radio itself.
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Re: My new project

Post by Dr. Radio on Sat Nov 15, 2014 11:23 pm

Part 2:

Okay, with the Crosley radio UNPLUGGED, connect the "output" of your audio tester right across the connections of the Crosley speaker.

The sound will be very faint. You may have to really crank up the volume on your audio rig and put your ear next to the speaker. You may even have to put a jumper wire across the in-line .1 capacitor to short it out. It depends on how much power output your audio rig has and how good your hearing is.

If you hear your music/audio playing from the Crosley speaker;

A) your audio tester works
B) the Speaker is good

If that is ok....

Make sure your .1 protection capacitor is in place and not shorted (if you put a jumper wire across it in the above test, it's time to remove the jumper now).

The next step is beginning to work backwards in the radio circuitry.

What you need to do is disconnect any wires from pin 1 and pin 7 of the 50B5 tube. All other wires should be left alone on this tube.

Now, carefully connect the output of the .1 cap to either pin 1 or pin 7 (doesn't matter which) of the 50B5. The "common" of you audio test rig will go to the "common" of the radio---or in other words B-.

Make sure connections are secure. Power up the radio.

Do you hear your music audio playing from the speaker????

It, again, won't be very loud, but should be quite audible. The volume control will have no effect, as what you have done has disconnected the audio path from all other stages of the radio.

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Re: My new project

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